Mary Jo's message really made me think.  My conclusion is that I don't
really know the goal of these SURE meetings.  If they are meant to give
the students the opportunity to talk amongst themselves freely enough so
that faculty presence is detrimental, then Roz definitely shouldn't be 
there either.  It must be ok for us to be there.

I understand Mary Jo's motivation, but I have a different view of the
situation.  In my opinion, the time for casual discussions of research
is when the student is alone with his or her advisor or friends, not at
a scheduled meeting to discuss research progress.  I'm not convinced
that it is even possible to discuss one's research casually with people who 
aren't familiar at all with the discipline (sometimes even to those in the 
discipline!);  some organized exposition is needed.  Besides, an integral 
part of the research experience is making presentations to audiences of 
strange and critical listeners.  Even if the presentation is informal, it
should still be a presentation.  I realize that having to do this 
every two weeks could be quite a strain, and could take away from true 
research time.  However, if the purpose of these meetings is to give the 
students practice in the art of describing their research progress, I think 
that there should be pressure on them to stand up and give good progress 
reports.  If the audience is almost non-existent and the atmosphere is 
casual, then that pressure won't exist.
 
I think that both Mary Jo and I want the students to be more
independent.  However, I think it's worth arguing the point that the way
to accomplish that might be to involve ourselves more (by expecting and
watching good presentations) rather than less (by not attending).  I see an 
opportunity here to apply some pressure and immunize these students (somewhat) 
from the fear of presenting personal work.

	Jon
